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Reincarnation
>
> I have a question in which I hope you can clarify. God is not a
>question in my mind. I have sensed God. All being one is not a question
>in my mind, even on a material level everything is connected together. I
>know when I die or at least my body it will be assimulated into the whole
>and take transient shape. So on that level along I never really die
>merely transform.
You have some very nice realizations. Individuality is always there. There is
no question of giving up our individual existence at any point. The soul, "I"
doesn't transform either. The soul is unchanging. Due to his consciousness he
is taking on different material bodies -- but he remains the same...
>My question is does consciousness have eternal life.
Bhagavad-Gita As It Is Chapter 2
TEXT 12
na tv evaham jatu nasam
na tvam neme janadhipah
na caiva na bhavisyamah
sarve vayam atah param
TRANSLATION
Never was there a time when I did not exist, nor you, nor all these kings; nor
in the future shall any of us cease to be.
PURPORT
In the Vedas, in the Katha Upanisad as well as in the Svetasvatara Upanisad,
it is said that the Supreme Personality of Godhead is the maintainer of
innumerable living entities, in terms of their different situations according
to individual work and reaction of work. That Supreme Personality of Godhead is
also, by His plenary portions, alive in the heart of every living entity. Only
saintly persons who can see, within and without, the same Supreme Lord can
actually attain to perfect and eternal peace.
nityo nityanam cetanas cetananam
eko bahunam yo vidadhati kaman
tam atma-stham ye 'nupasyanti dhiras
tesam santih sasvati netaresam
(Katha Upanisad 2.2.13)
The same Vedic truth given to Arjuna is given to all persons in the world
who pose themselves as very learned but factually have but a poor fund of
knowledge. The Lord says clearly that He Himself, Arjuna and all the kings who
are assembled on the battlefield are eternally individual beings and that the
Lord is eternally the maintainer of the individual living entities both in
their conditioned and in their liberated situations. The Supreme Personality of
Godhead is the supreme individual person, and Arjuna, the Lord's eternal
associate, and all the kings assembled there are individual eternal persons. It
is not that they did not exist as individuals in the past, and it is not that
they will not remain eternal persons. Their individuality existed in the past,
and their individuality will continue in the future without interruption.
Therefore, there is no cause for lamentation for anyone.
The Mayavadi theory that after liberation the individual soul, separated by
the covering of maya, or illusion, will merge into the impersonal Brahman and
lose its individual existence is not supported herein by Lord Krsna, the
supreme authority. Nor is the theory that we only think of individuality in the
conditioned state supported herein. Krsna clearly says herein that in the
future also the individuality of the Lord and others, as it is confirmed in the
Upanisads, will continue eternally. This statement of Krsna's is authoritative
because Krsna cannot be subject to illusion. If individuality were not a fact,
then Krsna would not have stressed it so much--even for the future. The
Mayavadi may argue that the individuality spoken of by Krsna is not spiritual,
but material. Even accepting the argument that the individuality is material,
then how can one distinguish Krsna's individuality? Krsna affirms His
individuality in the past and confirms His individuality in the future also. He
has confirmed His individuality in many ways, and impersonal Brahman has been
declared to be subordinate to Him. Krsna has maintained spiritual individuality
all along; if He is accepted as an ordinary conditioned soul in individual
consciousness, then His Bhagavad-gita has no value as authoritative scripture.
A common man with all the four defects of human frailty is unable to teach that
which is worth hearing. The Gita is above such literature. No mundane book
compares with the Bhagavad-gita. When one accepts Krsna as an ordinary man, the
Gita loses all importance. The Mayavadi argues that the plurality mentioned in
this verse is conventional and that it refers to the body. But previous to this
verse such a bodily conception is already condemned. After condemning the
bodily conception of the living entities, how was it possible for Krsna to
place a conventional proposition on the body again? Therefore, individuality is
maintained on spiritual grounds and is thus confirmed by great acaryas like Sri
Ramanuja and others. It is clearly mentioned in many places in the Gita that
this spiritual individuality is understood by those who are devotees of the
Lord. Those who are envious of Krsna as the Supreme Personality of Godhead have
no bona fide access to the great literature. The nondevotee's approach to the
teachings of the Gita is something like that of a bee licking on a bottle of
honey. One cannot have a taste of honey unless one opens the bottle. Similarly,
the mysticism of the Bhagavad-gita can be understood only by devotees, and no
one else can taste it, as it is stated in the Fourth Chapter of the book. Nor
can the Gita be touched by persons who envy the very existence of the Lord.
Therefore, the Mayavadi explanation of the Gita is a most misleading
presentation of the whole truth. Lord Caitanya has forbidden us to read
commentations made by the Mayavadis and warns that one who takes to such an
understanding of the Mayavadi philosophy loses all power to understand the real
mystery of the Gita. If individuality refers to the empirical universe, then
there is no need of teaching by the Lord. The plurality of the individual soul
and of the Lord is an eternal fact, and it is confirmed by the Vedas as
above-mentioned.
>Off course the Atman has eternal life, but does the jiva. If I've had
>past lives why cannot I remember them like I remember this life.
Birth means forgetfulness. It is maya's mercy... If we could remember we had
done the same thing for millions of births it would be difficult to become very
enthusiastiac about doing it again. Birth, old-age, disease and death, eating
sleeping, defending and sex... So we forget the past..
>I've had
>inklings feeling that at one point I was an Itlian monk, and at another a
>scotish warrior (which troubled me), yet were these inkling my
>imagination or is my farthur past trying to emerge. I pray to God that I
>can remember my future lives and or when I'm with him in the Godhead. You
>see to me eternal life is consciousness and when your not aware of
>yourself you are dead. In this life time along we go through many a death
>and rebirth. I seek the eternal rebirth. Maybe I'm just attached to my
>indiviuality (jiva)?
You are an individual eternally, that is not a bad attachment, it is natural.
This material world is a perverted reflection of the spiritual world. It is not
false -- mearly a reflection. So there is a hint of pleasure here, but the real
pleasure, the real substance is with Krishna in the spiritual world.. we can
just see the reflection. It is like the reflection of a mango tree in the
water. It looks exactly like a real mango tree, but you jump into the water and
try and grab those mangos! You can only get a hand full of water... The real
mango's are not in the reflection -- they're in the tree... So this sex life
and money in the material world is not the real source of pleasure, the real
pleasure is in the spiritual world...
>I don't think this is necessarily wrong. Why did God
>create color (form). I think one reason is ananda. Many an ascestic are
>attached to emptiness.
The form in the material world is a reflection of the form in the spiritual
world, the color here is a reflection of the color in the spiritual world, the
cows here are a reflection of the cows in the spiritual world, the trees here
are a reflecrtion of the trees in the spiritual world, the women here ar a
reflection of the women in the spiritual world... The difference is here we are
trying to enjoy everything for ourselves whereas in the spiritual world the
devotees there are using everything for the pleasure of Krishna... So we can
change our consciousness here and use everything for Krishna... Then this world
will also become just like the spiritual world...
>Li La seems to be were it's at. Sugar is sweet.
>Broken love is bitter. I'm getting side tracked. How can you help me to
>realize reincarnation or the eternal rebirth conscious of myself(form)
>and God (Non-form). Abeddabeda is enlightment right, not just one side?
>
Yes. Broken Love... Everyone's heartbroken. We establish a loving relationship
with someone here thinking that it will last forever and a few days later it's
finished... So such frustrated, broken-hearted men, with no knowledge of
Krishna or the spiritual world, conclude that there is nothing, no personality,
no ego, no individuality, no relationships... That is as far as one can get
without the help of a pure devotee of Krishna. Krishna is avan manasa gocara,
it means beyond the limits of the mind and the intelligance. So we can not
realize Krishna by our own effort, by mental specualtion, but we have to hear
about Krishna from someone who has seen Krishna. That is the process....
Bhagavad-gita Chapter 4
TEXT 34
tad viddhi pranipatena
pariprasnena sevaya
upadeksyanti te jnanam
jnaninas tatt va-darsinah
TRANSLATION
Just try to learn the truth by approaching a spiritual master. Inquire from
him submissively and render service unto him. The self-realized soul can impart
knowledge unto you because he has seen the truth.
PURPORT
The path of spiritual realization is undoubtedly difficult. The Lord therefore
advises us to approach a bona fide spiritual master in the line of disciplic
succession from the Lord Himself. No one can be a bona fide spiritual master
without following this principle of disciplic succession. The Lord is the
original spiritual master, and a person in the disciplic succession can convey
the message of the Lord as it is to his disciple. No one can be spiritually
realized by manufacturing his own process, as is the fashion of the foolish
pretenders. The Bhagavatam (6.3.19) says, dharmam tu saksad bhagavat-pranitam:
the path of religion is directly enunciated by the Lord. Therefore, mental
speculation or dry arguments cannot help lead one to the right path. Nor by
independent study of books of knowledge can one progress in spiritual life. One
has to approach a bona fide spiritual master to receive the knowledge. Such a
spiritual master should be accepted in full surrender, and one should serve the
spiritual master like a menial servant, without false prestige. Satisfaction of
the self-realized spiritual master is the secret of advancement in spiritual
life. Inquiries and submission constitute the proper combination for spiritual
understanding. Unless there is submission and service, inquiries from the
learned spiritual master will not be effective. One must be able to pass the
test of the spiritual master, and when he sees the genuine desire of the
disciple, he automatically blesses the disciple with genuine spiritual
understanding. In this verse, both blind following and absurd inquiries are
condemned. Not only should one hear submissively from the spiritual master, but
one must also get a clear understanding from him, in submission and service and
inquiries. A bona fide spiritual master is by nature very kind toward the
disciple. Therefore when the student is submissive and is always ready to
render service, the reciprocation of knowledge and inquiries becomes perfect.
Chant Hare Krishna and be happy!!
Madhudvisa dasa
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Chant Hare Krishna and be happy! All glories to His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada!