Krishna

Published on March 26th, 2011 | by

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Joining Krishna’s Pastimes

If one attains pure love of Godhead is it correct to say that at the time of death the soul is transferred to a planet in the universe(s) where Krishna’s pastimes are taking place?

Does one have a material body then?? (eg the Gopis complaining to Lord Brahma the creator of their eyelids in the Krishna book[which I take to be Krishnas pastimes as manifest on this planet 5000 years ago]) If so is it after the death of that body does one actually rekindle the relationship in the spiritual world. Is the relationship in the spiritual world the same always..in other words eg for the Gopis are they always with Krishna and Radha eternally developing their relationship or is it that life follows the format of the Krishna book again and again and again getting ever more blissful(but in this case there is birth and age and death to some extent)

Dear Khan Prabhu

Haribol! Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

Madhya 20.397 Lord Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu Instructs Sanatana Gosvami in the Science
“The eternal pastimes of Krsna are continuously taking place in the original Goloka Vrndavana planet. These same pastimes are gradually manifest within the material world, in each and every brahmanda.

Thanks for the nice questions. One thing is we can’t expect to be able to understand absolutely everything about Krishna and His pastimes in a very analytical way. We can underestand many things of course, but Krishna is avan-manasa-gochara, beyond the ability of our senses to experence and not conceivable by our mind. So the way to understand about Krishna to some extent is the process of hearing from a pure devotee of Krishna. That is the only way. Krishna is not understandable by the process of mental speculation or intelectual endeavors. Only by hearing from a pure devotee can we have some idea about Krishna and His pastimes.

SB 10.7.3 P The Killing of the Demon Trnavarta
Maharaja Pariksit requested Sukadeva Gosvami to narrate other childhood pastimes exhibited by Krsna while playing as a human child. The Supreme Personality of Godhead incarnates at different times in different planets and universes, and according to the nature of those places, He exhibits His unlimited potency. That a child sitting on the lap of his mother was able to kill the gigantic Putana is extremely wonderful for the inhabitants of this planet, but on other planets the inhabitants are more advanced, and therefore the pastimes the Lord performs there are still more wonderful. Krsna’s appearance on this planet like a human being makes us more fortunate than the demigods in the higher planets, and therefore Maharaja Pariksit was very much interested in hearing about Him.

If one develops pure love of God he does not have a material body even on this planet. This is related to a question you asked before and we talked about the example of an iron rod which is gradually heated until it becomes red-hot. So when the iron rod is red-hot it acts exactly as fire. It takes on all the qualities of fire.

It even sometimes appears to the materialists that Krishna has a material body when He appears in this world, but the Bhagavad-gita 9.11 lets us know that only fools and rascals consider Krishna’s body to be material and they deride Him. avajananti mam mudha manusim tanum asritam, param bhavam ajanato mama bhuta-mahesvaram “Fools deride Me when I descend in the human form. They do not know My transcendental nature and My supreme dominion over all that be.” It is an offence to consider that the Deity in the Temple is made of stone or that a pure devotee has a material body. So sometimes we do not understand what is material and what is spiritual. Acutally things are only material if they are not engaged in the service of Krishna. If something is engaged in the service of Krishna it is spiritual.

Also the idea that when Krishna is on this planet in Vrndavana or Dvarka or Mathura He is in the material world and when he is in Goloka Vrndavana He is in the spiritual world is not correct. Vrndavana on this planet is not in the material world. It is Krishna’s eternal abode which has descended onto this plant. It is also quite difficult for us to understand the nature of Vrndanvan and Srila Prabhupada said you cannot visit Vrndavana simply by purchasing an airline ticket. Many go to the place Vrndavan but do not actually see Vrndavana at all. It requires purified eyes to see. As people mistake Krishna’s body, the body of the Deity in the temple or the body or a pure devotee to be materilal, they think that Vrndavana in this world is material and somehow different to the Vrndavana in the spiritual world. It is not true. It is the same Vrndavana.

Adi 5.18 The Glories of Lord Nityananda Balarama
From the authoritative evidence cited by Jiva Gosvami we may conclude that Krsnaloka is the supreme planet in the spiritual sky, which is far beyond the material cosmos. For the enjoyment of transcendental variety, the pastimes of Krsna there have three divisions, and these pastimes are performed in the three abodes Dvaraka, Mathura and Gokula. When Krsna descends to this universe, He enjoys the pastimes in places of the same name. These places on earth are nondifferent from those original abodes, for they are facsimiles of those original holy places in the transcendental world. They are as good as Sri Krsna Himself and are equally worshipable. Lord Caitanya declared that Lord Krsna, who presents Himself as the son of the King of Vraja, is worshipable, and Vrndavana-dhama is equally worshipable.

There is one slight difference. In the spiritual world there are no demons, so when Krishna wants to fight he comes to the material world to exhibit His fighting spirit here…

Madhya 20.397 Lord Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu Instructs Sanatana Gosvami in the Science
There are two types of devotees–the sadhaka, who is preparing for perfection, and the siddha, who is already perfect. As far as those who are already perfect are concerned, Bhagavad-gita says, tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti so ‘rjuna: “After giving up this material body, such a devotee comes to Me.” After leaving the material body, the perfect devotee takes birth in the womb of a gopi on a planet where Krsna’s pastimes are going on. This may be in this universe or another universe. This statement is found in the Ujjvala-nilamani, which is commented upon by Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura. When a devotee becomes perfect, he is transferred to the universe where Krsna’s pastimes are taking place. Krsna’s eternal associates go wherever Krsna manifests His pastimes. As stated before, first the father and mother of Krsna appear, then the other associates. Quitting his material body, the perfect devotee also goes to associate with Krsna and His other associates.

So Srila Prabhupada here says the perfect devotee takes birth in the womb of a gopi on the planet where Krishna is manifesting His pastimes. He goes on to say, “Quiting his material body, the perfect devotee also goes to associate with Krishna and His other associates.” So when he takes birth on the planet where Krishna is having his pastimes from the womb of one of the gopis the perfect devotee does not have a material body.

KB 28 Releasing Nanda Maharaja from the Clutches of Varuna
Those who successfully practice bhakti-yoga, after giving up this present body, go directly to the spiritual world and become situated in one of the Vaikuntha planets. The inhabitants of Vrndavana are all pure devotees. Their destination after quitting the body is Krsnaloka. They even surpass the Vaikunthalokas. The fact is, those who are always engaged in Krsna consciousness and mature, pure devotional service are given the chance, after death, to gain Krsna’s association in the universes within the material world. Krsna’s pastimes are continually going on, either in this universe or in another universe. Just as the sun globe is passing through many places across this earthly planet, so Krsna-lila, or the transcendental advent and pastimes of Krsna, are also going on continually, either in this or another universe. The mature devotees, who have completely executed Krsna consciousness, are immediately transferred to the universe where Krsna is appearing. In that universe the devotees get their first opportunity to associate with Krsna personally and directly. The training goes on, as we see in the Vrndavana lila of Krsna within this planet.

The gopis don’t have material bodies. They may complain about Lord Brahma creating eyes that blink, but they are using their eyes to look at Krishna, so they are not at all material eyes…

My realization of exactly how the things work in the spiritual world is not so perfect. I can only repeat what I have heard from Srila Prabhupada and if we are fortunate enough to go there we will certainly understand the spiritual world much better then. The spiritual world is completely different from the materilal world, we have no experiences here to compare to the spiritual world. So it is difficult for us to conceive or even imagine what it is like. We know the time factor does not act there, there is no past and future, everything is eternally present… So how can we understand that? We have no experience of such a thing, we cannot even imagine it. But we accept it as being perfect knowledge of the spiritual world because we have heard it from Srila Prabhupada.
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We may not completely realize what it means, but we have heard it from Prabhupada, so that is perfect knowledge. We also know that there is no birth or death there, there is no old age or disease, there is no anxiety. We know there are desire trees there that will supply the devotees with anything they want, we know there are subari cows that will give one as much milk as he desires at any time. There are so many things we know about the spiritual world from the Brahma-samhita and other books also. And ultimately, if we strictly follow the process of Krishna consciousness by chanting at least 16 rounds of the Hare Krishna mantra daily and following the four regulative principles [no illicit sex, no meat eating, no gambling and no intoxication] and if we read Srila Prabhupada’s books constantly and engage in serving Krishna under the direction of a bona fide spiritual master 24 hours a day perhaps Krishna will reveal to us the nature of His Goloka Vrndavana planet.

We cannot understand these things by our own strength. They are beyond the ability of our senses to experience and beyond the power of our mind to conceive. So the only way we will be able to understand these things is if Krishna reveals the knowledge to us.

Madhya 20.397 Lord Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu Instructs Sanatana Gosvami in the Science
Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura elucidates this complicated explanation of Krsna’s pastimes. Krsna’s pastimes are always present in the material world in one of the many universes. These pastimes appear in the universes one after the other, just as the sun moves across the sky and measures the time. Krsna’s appearance may be manifest in this universe at one moment, and immediately after His birth, this pastime is manifest in the next universe. After His killing of Putana is manifest in this universe, it is next manifest in another universe. Thus all the pastimes of Krsna are eternally existing both in the original Goloka Vrndavana planet and in the material universes. The 125 years calculated in our solar system to be Krsna’s lifetime equal one moment for Krsna. One moment these pastimes are manifest in one universe, and the next moment they are manifest in the next universe. There are unlimited universes, and Krsna’s pastimes are manifest one moment after the other in all of them.
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This rotation is explained through the example of the sun’s moving across the sky. Krsna appears and disappears in innumerable universes, just as the sun appears and disappears during the day. Although the sun appears to rise and set, it is continuously shining somewhere on the earth. Although Krsna’s pastimes seem to appear and disappear, they are continuously existing in one brahmanda (universe) or another. Thus all of Krsna’s lilas are present simultaneously throughout the innumerable universes. By our limited senses we cannot appreciate this; therefore Krsna’s eternal pastimes are very difficult for us to understand. One should try to understand how they are taking place by understanding the allegory of the sun. Although the Lord is appearing constantly in the material universes, His pastimes are eternally present in the original Goloka Vrndavana. Therefore these pastimes are called nitya-lila (eternally present pastimes). Because we cannot see what is going on in other universes, it is a little difficult for us to understand how Krsna is eternally manifesting His pastimes.
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There are fourteen Manus in one day of Brahma, and this time calculation is also taking place in other universes. Krsna’s pastimes are manifest before fourteen Manus expire. Although it is a little difficult to understand the eternal pastimes of Krsna in this way, we must accept the verdict of Vedic literatures.

Madhya 21.104 The Opulence and Sweetness of Lord Sri Krsna
When we consider impartially all the unlimited pastimes of the Lord, we find that His pastimes as a human being on this planet–wherein He sports as a cowherd boy with a flute in His hands and appears youthful and fresh like a ballet dancer–are pastimes and features that are never subjected to material laws and inebrieties. The wonderful beauty of Krsna is presented in the supreme planet, Gokula (Goloka Vrndavana). Inferior to that is His representation in the spiritual sky, and inferior to that is His representation in the external energy (Devi-dhama). A mere drop of Krsna’s sweetness can drown these three worlds–Goloka Vrndavana, Hari-dhama (Vaikunthaloka), and Devi-dhama (the material world). Everywhere, Krsna’s beauty merges everyone in the ecstasy of transcendental bliss. Actually the activities of yogamaya are absent in the spiritual sky and the Vaikuntha planets. She simply works in the supreme planet, Goloka Vrndavana, and she works to manifest the activities of Krsna when He descends to the material universe to please His innumerable devotees within the material world. Thus a replica of the Goloka Vrndavana planet and the pastimes there are manifest on this planet on a specific tract of land–Bhauma Vrndavana, the Vrndavana-dhama on this planet.

KB 28 Releasing Nanda Maharaja from the Clutches of Varuna
Everyone is under the impression that he is of this material world, and with this concept of life, everyone is working in ignorance in different forms of life. The activities of the particular type of body are called karma, or fruitive action. All conditioned souls under the impression of the bodily concept are working according to their particular types of body. These activities are creating their future conditional life. Because they have very little information of the spiritual world, they do not generally take to spiritual activities, which are called bhakti-yoga. Those who successfully practice bhakti-yoga, after giving up this present body, go directly to the spiritual world and become situated in one of the Vaikuntha planets. The inhabitants of Vrndavana are all pure devotees. Their destination after quitting the body is Krsnaloka. They even surpass the Vaikunthalokas. The fact is, those who are always engaged in Krsna consciousness and mature, pure devotional service are given the chance, after death, to gain Krsna’s association in the universes within the material world. Krsna’s pastimes are continually going on, either in this universe or in another universe. Just as the sun globe is passing through many places across this earthly planet, so Krsna-lila, or the transcendental advent and pastimes of Krsna, are also going on continually, either in this or another universe. The mature devotees, who have completely executed Krsna consciousness, are immediately transferred to the universe where Krsna is appearing. In that universe the devotees get their first opportunity to associate with Krsna personally and directly. The training goes on, as we see in the Vrndavana lila of Krsna within this planet. Krsna therefore revealed the actual feature of the Vaikuntha planets so that the inhabitants of Vrndavana could know their destination.

670101CC.NY Lectures
So within these 125 years, all the pastimes that Krsna displayed during His presence, all those things are going on in each and every universe, just like the sun planet is moving from one place to another. This is the idea of Krsna-lila.

HDG A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

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